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GMH2
Post subject: Re: Ashley Giles
PostPosted: 13:39 on 9th Apr 2014

Joined: 10:48 on 22nd Aug 2011
Posts: 98
Cuthbert Rizla Wrote:
Whoever gets the job I'd like to see an end to the current non-sensical policy of retaining players in the England squad who are out of form in the hope they just might come good in an international.

To me part of the problem on the Aussie tour was well-established players,comforted by a juicy England contract,not appearing to care too much.

I want to see the best in-form county players picked for a series and fast-tracking of anyone good enough.These days it seems you can have one player performing consistently crap for England and another playing out of their skins for their county and not getting a look-in for at least a year.

It works in football and rugby, why not in cricket ?

Oh, and get rid of half the backroom staff. If a professional sportsman needs a dietician to tell him what to eat he shouldn't be representing his country.


Agree with much of this.
Stuart Lancasters approach to selection for RFU - Not scared to put in youngesters who are performing for their clubs, regardless of age or size of match. They pay you back for the opportunity or show that they don't cut the mustard, either way you are not left wondering.
Within a year he has turned that (pretty weak) team into one of the favourites for next years WC.
I personally feel that this would work as well for the cricket team.
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blueandy1mac
Post subject: Re: Ashley Giles
PostPosted: 15:08 on 9th Apr 2014

Joined: 12:30 on 14th Jul 2008
Posts: 2095
Location: Preston UK
GMH2 Wrote:
Cuthbert Rizla Wrote:
Whoever gets the job I'd like to see an end to the current non-sensical policy of retaining players in the England squad who are out of form in the hope they just might come good in an international.

To me part of the problem on the Aussie tour was well-established players,comforted by a juicy England contract,not appearing to care too much.

I want to see the best in-form county players picked for a series and fast-tracking of anyone good enough.These days it seems you can have one player performing consistently crap for England and another playing out of their skins for their county and not getting a look-in for at least a year.

It works in football and rugby, why not in cricket ?

Oh, and get rid of half the backroom staff. If a professional sportsman needs a dietician to tell him what to eat he shouldn't be representing his country.


Agree with much of this.
Stuart Lancasters approach to selection for RFU - Not scared to put in youngesters who are performing for their clubs, regardless of age or size of match. They pay you back for the opportunity or show that they don't cut the mustard, either way you are not left wondering.
Within a year he has turned that (pretty weak) team into one of the favourites for next years WC.
I personally feel that this would work as well for the cricket team.


TBH I'm not sure he's that clued up on cricket, might be worth a punt though. (I'll get me coat)
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addtamx
Post subject: Re: Ashley Giles
PostPosted: 23:05 on 9th Apr 2014

Joined: 21:02 on 9th May 2008
Posts: 950
Location: Australia
I don't necessarily disagree with Rizzla there but just playing devils advocate there is another side to this coin........

A very good chunk of our players during this "successful" period we have just come out of had pretty average starts to their International career. How would we have fared if the likes of Cook, Bell, Jimmy, Broad, Prior etc were all discarded early on when they were struggling to make the grade??

I think it is a credit to our past management that the ability in these players was recognised and that they managed to get them all to develop into the class players they became.

To me it is not necessarily as simple as if you don't perform your out, that's nice in theory but does it work in practise?? Get rid of Joe Root now for example and tag him as a "tried and failed".......could we be tossing out someone who could potentially go on and score 7 - 8K test runs like Cook and Bell??

I reckon we took this hard line with Compo and it has been to our detriment ever since.

I comes down to the coaches to recognise whether the players they have that aren't performing to the levels that they'd like have the game to become class players (ala Jimmy and Bell) or if they are just never gonna make it at this level (ala Bopara)

The real question is do we have faith in the management to make these judgments correctly?? 3 years ago I did.........now, not so much.
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GMH2
Post subject: Re: Ashley Giles
PostPosted: 10:35 on 10th Apr 2014

Joined: 10:48 on 22nd Aug 2011
Posts: 98
blueandy1mac Wrote:
GMH2 Wrote:
Cuthbert Rizla Wrote:
Whoever gets the job I'd like to see an end to the current non-sensical policy of retaining players in the England squad who are out of form in the hope they just might come good in an international.

To me part of the problem on the Aussie tour was well-established players,comforted by a juicy England contract,not appearing to care too much.

I want to see the best in-form county players picked for a series and fast-tracking of anyone good enough.These days it seems you can have one player performing consistently crap for England and another playing out of their skins for their county and not getting a look-in for at least a year.

It works in football and rugby, why not in cricket ?

Oh, and get rid of half the backroom staff. If a professional sportsman needs a dietician to tell him what to eat he shouldn't be representing his country.


Agree with much of this.
Stuart Lancasters approach to selection for RFU - Not scared to put in youngesters who are performing for their clubs, regardless of age or size of match. They pay you back for the opportunity or show that they don't cut the mustard, either way you are not left wondering.
Within a year he has turned that (pretty weak) team into one of the favourites for next years WC.
I personally feel that this would work as well for the cricket team.


TBH I'm not sure he's that clued up on cricket, might be worth a punt though. (I'll get me coat)


He can't do any worse mate !
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Minhosa
Post subject: Re: Ashley Giles
PostPosted: 12:11 on 10th Apr 2014

Joined: 08:07 on 21st Jul 2010
Posts: 115
addtamx Wrote:
It comes down to the coaches to recognise whether the players they have that aren't performing to the levels that they'd like have the game to become class players (ala Jimmy and Bell) or if they are just never gonna make it at this level (ala Bopara)

The real question is do we have faith in the management to make these judgments correctly?? 3 years ago I did.........now, not so much.


I agree with his; we need fresh personnel and fresh ideas in the coaching/backroom staff. Coaches have a shelf life and ours have past theirs a couple of years ago. We can't keep going for the 'safe' yes man option. But then we have the ECB hiring!! :(

I spent the day watching the England nets at Adelaide and knew we were going to get hammered; there was no energy, everything looked and felt stale. The likes of Gooch, Mushie etc times are up.

Also agree with the point about Compton (same could be said of James Taylor) who were discarded very harshly, whilst the dross that is Dernbach get picked no matter what they produce on the pitch. Seems your face either fits or it doesn't which smacks of the dark days of English cricket...
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addtamx
Post subject: Re: Ashley Giles
PostPosted: 23:01 on 10th Apr 2014

Joined: 21:02 on 9th May 2008
Posts: 950
Location: Australia
Minhosa Wrote:

I agree with his; we need fresh personnel and fresh ideas in the coaching/backroom staff. Coaches have a shelf life and ours have past theirs a couple of years ago.


This is so true, but I've never understood why this this so prevalent in cricket and not so much in other sports?

The Flower, Gooch, Saker partnership was probably as good as we've ever had....how did it go from being so good to so shite in a matter of a couple of years??

PS.

And totally OT.....

Sorry I didn't get the chance to catch up with you and Holgate in Adelaide Mark. Had my 78yo Dad in tow with me which was great but limited my movements somewhat. Managed to get him to PJ's one night but it was just too full on and noisy for the old bugger so we only stayed 10 mins.
Followed you on twitter though and looks like you had a terrific time.....save for the cricket!!
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Marine45
Post subject: Re: Ashley Giles
PostPosted: 18:16 on 16th Apr 2014

Joined: 18:39 on 5th Jun 2013
Posts: 35
After reading all previous I would replace Downton with Mac
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Minhosa
Post subject: Re: Ashley Giles
PostPosted: 11:39 on 22nd Apr 2014

Joined: 08:07 on 21st Jul 2010
Posts: 115
addtamx Wrote:
Sorry I didn't get the chance to catch up with you and Holgate in Adelaide Mark. Had my 78yo Dad in tow with me which was great but limited my movements somewhat. Managed to get him to PJ's one night but it was just too full on and noisy for the old bugger so we only stayed 10 mins.
Followed you on twitter though and looks like you had a terrific time.....save for the cricket!!


Likewise mate, would have been good to meet up. You're right PJs did get pretty rammed throughout that week. Despite the cricket I had a great time...would do it all again in a flash.

There's always next tour... :D

M
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