Forum

Login        Register

It is currently 10:45 on Tuesday 21 October 2014



Board Index » Archive » Ashes Summer 09


Post new topic Reply to topic Page 1 of 3 [ 22 posts ] Go to page 1, 2, 3 Next
Author Message
Maidenover
Post subject: Momentum
PostPosted: 16:33 on 20th Sep 2009

Joined: 09:13 on 23rd Apr 2008
Posts: 2913
There we have it, the momentum is with the ECB as we go to the latest limited overs tournament, this time in SA (where according to one hack the ECB can save some money on hotels by getting many of the players to stay with their relatives).

I feel sure that when the squads are finalised (the selectors can't have decided prior to this final, seventh, ODI, surely), the likes of Bopara, Shah, Bresnan, Morgan, Onions, etc, will have cemented their places without consideration of the lesser abilities of the likes of Trott, Bell, Rashid, etc.

The batting order has been firmed up, the front-line bowlers a shoe-in, the spinners in place, keeper sorted (Prior surely has firmly earnt his place somewhere in the batting order, well above where the likes of Davies, Jones, Mustard, etc, would be thought about).

We'll soon show that Sri Lankan lot what one-day cricket is all about :roll:
Top
Reply with quote
Burnhope
Post subject: Re: Momentum
PostPosted: 16:58 on 20th Sep 2009

Joined: 18:05 on 30th Mar 2009
Posts: 682
Location: Oxford
Maidenover Wrote:
There we have it, the momentum is with the ECB as we go to the latest limited overs tournament, this time in SA (where according to one hack the ECB can save some money on hotels by getting many of the players to stay with their relatives).

I feel sure that when the squads are finalised (the selectors can't have decided prior to this final, seventh, ODI, surely), the likes of Bopara, Shah, Bresnan, Morgan, Onions, etc, will have cemented their places without consideration of the lesser abilities of the likes of Trott, Bell, Rashid, etc.

The batting order has been firmed up, the front-line bowlers a shoe-in, the spinners in place, keeper sorted (Prior surely has firmly earnt his place somewhere in the batting order, well above where the likes of Davies, Jones, Mustard, etc, would be thought about).

We'll soon show that Sri Lankan lot what one-day cricket is all about :roll:



So very fickle!
Top
Reply with quote
Maidenover
Post subject: Re: Momentum
PostPosted: 08:18 on 21st Sep 2009

Joined: 09:13 on 23rd Apr 2008
Posts: 2913
I'm all for consistency of selection, but it should be retaining those players that stand out above the rest, and I don't think the current crop fit that bill.

I mentioned Prior not because he's a keeper but more because he doesn't to me seem to be so much better than Steven Davies, Geraint Jones, Phil Mustard, or James Foster, etc, either. With Prior he's clearly worked hard on his game and has undoubtedly improved his keeping, but he now needs to work on his batting again. I don't understand how he can be picked before he's acquired all the necessary skills first.

To my mind the same applies to, for instance, Bopara and Shah, and equally I'm puzzled by the inclusion of Bresnan (ahead of, say, Napier). It's well documented that Flower sees Bopara as quality, but is he any better than many others (Bell, Trott, etc)? Bresnan must have put the fear of god into the Aussies, in the same way that Freddie or Harmy used to, or am I missing something.

I've never really understood the mantra of developing young players in the international team, rather than picking them after they've proved themselves. I'd be looking at who's contributing to our top sides (eg Durham) and seeing how we can get those inform players into the side rather than picking Division 2 players like Bopara and Shah. Players should be picked regardless of age if they show quality and form, but they have to be displaying both at the time. If there arent enough ECB eligible players in our top teams, we need and must change the system to ensure they do (as the Aussies, generally, don't have our or other countries' players as overseas professionals).

What are we doing with Rashid? In the one good game he showed he can contribute with both bat and ball and unlike Shah he can stand up in the field as well. Next game, leave him out. A leg spinner will do more damage in SA than an off-spinner (although I'd guess Swann will do well). Why don't we just pick our best players and play both spinners in each game?

Fickle, no not really, just puzzled by the process of selecting our best side regardless of the format. :? :cry:
Top
Reply with quote
Burnhope
Post subject: Re: Momentum
PostPosted: 15:53 on 21st Sep 2009

Joined: 18:05 on 30th Mar 2009
Posts: 682
Location: Oxford
Maidenover Wrote:
I'm all for consistency of selection, but it should be retaining those players that stand out above the rest, and I don't think the current crop fit that bill.

I mentioned Prior not because he's a keeper but more because he doesn't to me seem to be so much better than Steven Davies, Geraint Jones, Phil Mustard, or James Foster, etc, either. With Prior he's clearly worked hard on his game and has undoubtedly improved his keeping, but he now needs to work on his batting again. I don't understand how he can be picked before he's acquired all the necessary skills first.

To my mind the same applies to, for instance, Bopara and Shah, and equally I'm puzzled by the inclusion of Bresnan (ahead of, say, Napier). It's well documented that Flower sees Bopara as quality, but is he any better than many others (Bell, Trott, etc)? Bresnan must have put the fear of god into the Aussies, in the same way that Freddie or Harmy used to, or am I missing something.

I've never really understood the mantra of developing young players in the international team, rather than picking them after they've proved themselves. I'd be looking at who's contributing to our top sides (eg Durham) and seeing how we can get those inform players into the side rather than picking Division 2 players like Bopara and Shah. Players should be picked regardless of age if they show quality and form, but they have to be displaying both at the time. If there arent enough ECB eligible players in our top teams, we need and must change the system to ensure they do (as the Aussies, generally, don't have our or other countries' players as overseas professionals).

What are we doing with Rashid? In the one good game he showed he can contribute with both bat and ball and unlike Shah he can stand up in the field as well. Next game, leave him out. A leg spinner will do more damage in SA than an off-spinner (although I'd guess Swann will do well). Why don't we just pick our best players and play both spinners in each game?

Fickle, no not really, just puzzled by the process of selecting our best side regardless of the format. :? :cry:


I meant fickle about Prior! Apart from that i agree with you.
Top
Reply with quote
Maidenover
Post subject: Re: Momentum
PostPosted: 21:39 on 26th Sep 2009

Joined: 09:13 on 23rd Apr 2008
Posts: 2913
We leave out Bopara and Bresnan, and win. When KP comes back for Shah, we have the makings of a winning side ... ish.

Shah's runing is enough for me to suggest he just shouldn't be there, and could/should have been out well before his contribution to the SL win. He's a rubbish fielder as well

All we've to do, is pick Rashid, and we're looking good ........
Top
Reply with quote
Burnhope
Post subject: Re: Momentum
PostPosted: 17:21 on 28th Sep 2009

Joined: 18:05 on 30th Mar 2009
Posts: 682
Location: Oxford
Maidenover Wrote:
We leave out Bopara and Bresnan, and win. When KP comes back for Shah, we have the makings of a winning side ... ish.

Shah's runing is enough for me to suggest he just shouldn't be there, and could/should have been out well before his contribution to the SL win. He's a rubbish fielder as well
All we've to do, is pick Rashid, and we're looking good ........


Eat your words please! :lol:
Top
Reply with quote
Maidenover
Post subject: Re: Momentum
PostPosted: 18:24 on 28th Sep 2009

Joined: 09:13 on 23rd Apr 2008
Posts: 2913
One good innings, at last, but he's still rubbish at running between the wickets and, go on, defend his fielding ... dropped Smith remember, which could have cost the game. Once he consistently performs I'll willingly agee but are you expecting him to retain his place once KP is fit? and what was Bopara doing when he came in against SA, he needed to simply give Morgan, who was on fire, the strike, but instead he goes for the big shot first off?

What I am happy about is the, in a strange, roundabout, way, we are going to have a side without Bopara, Bresnan, and now Prior. We just might be getting it right, eventually. Looking forward to seeing Davies in the side, as to me he has the something that Morgan is now showing and which Bopara, Bresnan, Prior, and Shah don't (in my opinion). Onions is OK instead of Bresnan, but obviously is no Freddie. KP and Freddie instead of Onions and Shah and we really are getting somewhere.
Top
Reply with quote
Maidenover
Post subject: Re: Momentum
PostPosted: 21:09 on 29th Sep 2009

Joined: 09:13 on 23rd Apr 2008
Posts: 2913
Shah .... pah!!!
Top
Reply with quote
fernando
Post subject: Re: Momentum
PostPosted: 11:12 on 30th Sep 2009

Joined: 12:48 on 25th Apr 2008
Posts: 1873
Think you've got it in for Shah haven't you.
Top
Reply with quote
Maidenover
Post subject: Re: Momentum
PostPosted: 16:19 on 30th Sep 2009

Joined: 09:13 on 23rd Apr 2008
Posts: 2913
Prefer Bopara to him (did I really just say that?), but think Bopara is equally not got it. Shah's inability to run between the wickets, field/catch, or even look like an athlete in the field worries me. There are some who've got it and some who will never get it, and for me Shah falls in the latter category (and so does Bopara). There are some who seem to get opportunity after opportunity and still don't perform and there are others who never get a sniff. I've always thought you can spot quality a mile off, and particularly at the top level, and Morgan is one who seems to have something about him. There are some exceptions, of course, but Shah just doesn't inspire me, but it's just my opinion.
Top
Reply with quote
Post new topic Reply to topic Page 1 of 3 [ 22 posts ] Go to page 1, 2, 3 Next